Spyshadow01

14 hours ago, SmegHedd117 said:

The topic is "Name and shame". You kids think that you can dictate to everyone how to play and treat those who don't play the way you want, like crap! That's the way y'all have treated me from the start. Because i snipe with MBT's and don't play the classes the way most of you DEMAND they be played. and when i voice my opinion in Discord, i got banned because the admins didn't like what i said, nevermind if i was correct or not. I have studied armor tactics for many years, and rushing straight into the teeth of enemy fire, and allowing yourself to be shot at, is just plain stupid, and i won't do it, at least not like you kids do. and yes, i say kids, because i'm 60 years old, and i'd say most of you are in your early twenties IF that.........

It's always nice when the pubbie names and shames himself.

Bob gave a pretty good overview of the PTS in its current state in his post.  I played a little yesterday and found the changes to be overwhelmingly negative, to the point where if even half of these changes reach the live server I will probably stop playing the game.

Pretty much what I expected.  Only surprise was the inclusion of the Kashtet, but I'm primarily a PVE player so that may just be a limitation of my perspective.  I'm not sure I'd call the armor on the T15 strong, but that might just be because high DPM vehicles turn me into an overly-aggressive brainlet.

6 hours ago, dfnce said:

In terms of damage the tank is some competitor to broken pos M247 Sergeant York which destroyed tier 5 pve, but gladly matchmaker doesn't mix them too often

Not that beating pubbies is a particularly high accomplishment, but I did win a damage race with a York on SH Ch2 while trying to do some BP missions.  This tank's ability to be nearly constantly firing is a huge boon.  Its definitely up there with the York and M95 in terms of tier-for-tier power.

The missiles can get the occasional one-shot ammo rack if you have a commander with a bit of module damage bonuses (I was using Rashid when I played it).  However, with the currently bugged behavior of the missiles, it's not really possible to aim at these points right now.

20 minutes ago, Haswell said:

Moved to Venting Room, since we don't have a psychiatric ward yet.

Should have become our first garbage bin thread tbh.

>Hunter gets PELE

I kind of hope this is an error, otherwise it's just going to be a generally better redback for everything other than getting infantry missions done.  Even without PELE it looks p. strong.

I'd be down to help you with this.

1 hour ago, Beady_Eyed_Bob said:

The error here is the assumption that 665 is an "Average" and that the game is telling you that 665 is an "average".

The error here was the assumption that what you called average damage and what the game called average damage were the same thing, which led to your post stating that the Kornet-E would do slightly less damage than the Ataka.  Regardless of whether or not you want to split hairs over how what the game calls average damage isn't a "proper" average, call it "base damage" if you really must, the information in that post was wrong and I corrected it.  Kornet-E will do more damage per shot than the Ataka.

9 minutes ago, Komitadjie said:

Still rather weak, damage-wise, by comparison to a lot of other available rounds at 8 that will regularly break 900+.  Compensating is really good speed and pen, of course.  The four-second swap time is pretty long as well for something that's supposed to use missiles as its main armament.  We'll have to see.  I'm not *all* that hopeful, given that we know how useful fixed launchers are on most other platforms that have them.

Yeah, trying to emphasize the missile armament and then saddling the vehicle with a fixed launcher is a questionable design choice, to be sure.

9 hours ago, Beady_Eyed_Bob said:

Why would you exclude the variables from your "average"?

Because that's how the game denotes average damage.  I got my 665 figure from the game itself.

1 hour ago, Beady_Eyed_Bob said:

My BMPT 2017 (tier 8 Premium) Ataka "M" damage range is 599-951, hence my claim of 775 average.

Yes, but that range takes into account the bonus damage that HEAT receives against thin armor.  You can see this yourself by taking the Ataka's average damage of 665 and multiplying it by 1.1 (10% RNG) and then multiplying it again by 1.30 (30% bonus damage against thin armor) and you will get 950.95.  When the game gives an "average damage" for things like HEAT shells, it does not take into account the bonus damage against thin armor.

On 5/5/2020 at 6:21 PM, Katsumoto said:

As a point that I just noticed:

- AP rounds have their maximum ricochet angle at 67 degrees.  There is only 1 round in the game that I know of that has 70 degrees (130mm DM23 for the Leopard 2AX).

T14 has 69 degrees.

2 hours ago, Beady_Eyed_Bob said:

I'm confused (but I'm used to it),

I have a BMPT 2017.

Stats on Ataka "M" are pen = 950, avg damg = 775, 3 second firing delay between missles.

Ataka M's average damage is 665.  This vehicle is also replacing the Terminator Proto and not the BMPT 2017.  Proto uses baseline Ataka which 850 pen and the same 665 average damage.  The Mod.2000's missiles will do significantly more damage and have a 150mm penetration advantage over the ones on the vehicle it is replacing.  The only downside in comparison to the other termi's missiles is the fixed launcher.

2 hours ago, Haswell said:

This is fine. Not even using v2 retros.

yeah, as I said, this thing has some intense vision control potential in spite of its deficiencies in speed and camo on-the-move.

This is the AS21 Redback.  It's F A T.  It's also not completely awful.  Here's a quick rundown of what I think of the vehicle, keeping in mind that I almost exclusively play PvE.

Pros:

• A massive amount of ammo, 2000 rounds in total for the autocannon and 50 questionably-useful top-attack missiles
• An autocannon that fires fast enough to warrant having 2000 rounds of stowed ammo, provides 20k DPM with PELE on my set up
• PELE lets you do stupid things like pen MBT engine decks from absurd angles (even protectors!)
• Mortar squad gets a 2nd mortar (!), AT squad gets one more guy as well
• It has a high base view-range with modules that increase that view range further.  (my current set up has 530/560m when moving/stationary)
• Camo loss when firing the autocannon is marginal

Cons:

• To go along with being F A T it also has relatively poor base camo
• It's mobility is almost MBT-like, very slow
• Poor armor, only somewhat resistant to autocannons and nothing beyond that
• AP pen is medicore (192)
• Autocannon damage per shot is unimpressive (23 AP, 30 PELE)
• Top Attack missiles are finicky, and deal less damage to vehicles with unmanned turrets

In practice, this vehicle seems to excel at mid-range engagements where it can hide using terrain and its decent camo when firing.  If you can get some degree of elevation over your targets, that's even better, as the PELE rounds can really tear into the top of the turrets or other such weak spots that normal ammo could not.  The improved infantry squads also give it an edge over other infantry-carrying vehicles (especially if you prefer the mortar), which further augments its already fairly good damage potential.  However, its massive size and lack of armor makes it fairly vulnerable to getting rushed down and spotted.  This also means that maps that tend to force close-range engagements will be tough on the AS21.  I also haven't had much luck trying to reach classic AFV spots like the NE corner of Quarterback or Stormy Winter due to the vehicle's poor mobility and mediocre on-the-move camo, so that's something to keep in mind as well. 

It's also good for making puny tanklets envious of your massive girth.  As pictured here, with my AS21 alongside two tanklets.

On 3/17/2020 at 1:03 PM, Haswell said:

Small update, I somehow thought tier 8 AT infantry uses HEAT-MP instead of normal HEAT. Fixed.

So does tier 8 AT infantry have an average damage of 200 per hit as per your chart?  That doesn't jive with my experience using them.

I will say that while C3/C4 isn't a great place for a player to sit, it is a fairly good place for an AT team.  At least it seemed to work well in T8, but I don't see why it wouldn't in T10.

A little hidden aspect of this patch, a buffed K2.  Turret face now provides approx 1000/1500 of protection against KE/HEAT, with the mid-hull providing about 850/1200 KE/HEAT.  Turret ring is still 770 against HEAT, and LFP protection is still inconsequential (effective only against autocannons), and according to the armor viewer the T15's missiles can still hit the turret ammo rack through the turret ring weakspot.  Also, something interesting:

Apparently K2 is a wheeled vehicle.

edit:

They also removed the weirdly strong turret roof armor.

better than it was, but still a worse hellfire.  Didn't get a single one-shot ammo rack, and only got one one-shot fuel hit on a bradley, and that's using sabrina.

Prepare for a big, dumb screenshot infodump.  You can apparently access the K2's tank page via the new commander, who you can access via the commander's tab.

Here is its stat card:

And here is its full module page:

And here are some screenshots of it in the armor viewer:

Some things to note here: 

• It has a third gun option not mentioned in its article - a single shot 120mm with a base reload of 7.5s.
• KAPS has 4 charges and reloads in 5 seconds, the same as the K21.
• There's no indication as to what "special properties" the smoke dischargers have.
• Tank accelerates to 70 km/h in 22.5s with the stock engine, or to 75 km/h in 23.4s with the upgraded engine.
• The tank is covered in ammo racks.  Almost anywhere on the front pennable to HEAT can damage either your turret or hull ammo rack.
• Weirdly high turret roof armor in some places may make getting trick shots with PELE/PISH difficult in PVP, or if the K2 gets added to the PVE bot pool.
• Armor viewer confirms that the only ammo type is a 590/850 dmg/pen APFSDS shell, with an accompanying 7.62mm MG.

Consider the hype official dead.

IN DEVELOPMENT: K2 BLACK PANTHER

Full article is above, but I'll lay out some highlights here:

• Armor will be roughly equivalent to the 2AX or Altay
• Tank will feature special smoke grenades with "better properties," no other information given
• In its stock form it will be one of the most mobile MBTs in the game, only beaten by hybrid-engine equipped MBTs
• Only shell available for the vehicle is a 850mm pen APFSDS round
• Will be able to chose between a 3 shot ready rack or a 2 shot magazine loader
• Looks like it will have two tiers of mutually exclusive firepower upgrades, similar to the leclerc
• Has the designate target special ability
• Will have three overprogression modules: A hybrid engine, a module that improves view range and designate target's duration (think K1A1), and one that improves module protection and repair times

My immediate thought regarding this vehicle is that the lack of a HEAT round is going to severely harm this vehicle's PVE potential unless the standard AP round has massively boosted damage compared to other 120mm AP rounds.  Given the info in the article, I think the choice between the ready rack and the autoloader is a no brainer.  They both have the same intra-magazine load-time of 4 seconds, but the ready rack then drops to a 9.5s reload when depleted.  The magazine loader, meanwhile, reloads both of its shells in 13s, which is functionally equivalent to a 6.5s reload time per shell.  If the K2's magazine loader is capable of quick partial reloads (like the pre-nerf CATTB), then it will be even more preferable.  A potential argument for the ready rack may be to get both of the "magazine size" tiered firepower upgrades to increase its rack capacity to 5 rounds, but frankly I think the magazine loader with reduced intra-magazine reload or overall reload time will still be preferable.  Designate target might also allow you to more easily complete assist damage contract missions if you really hate AFV/LT gameplay too, I guess.

Ultimately, I think the tier 9s are going to be highlights of this line.  The K2, as outlined in this article, looks rather disappointing.  Does anyone else feel differently?  Maybe someone with more PVP experience can give a good prejudgement on its PVP potential?

I think limiting the AT infantry to firing only within their own view range, and then also nerfing that view range, might be too much.  However, we'll have to see how much they nerf their view range by, if at all.  Limiting them to firing within the render range limit would have been enough imo.

You can find this information out in the game, by using the global vehicle directory and filtering for mechanized infantry.